Vote Democrat to save our freedom.

[NATHAN LLOYD]

The republicans are turning our country into a communist country with the constant excuse of fighting terrorism. The president can lock people up forever without a right of appeal, and he can wiretap whomever he chooses. This way if he is doing something amoral he can always cover his tracks. The Republicans are taking away our rights, and turning this country into a communist country.

[TonyM]

Vote Libertarian to get free from government control.

[TheChartGuru]

The republicans are turning our country into a communist country with the constant excuse of fighting terrorism. The president can lock people up forever without a right of appeal, and he can wiretap whomever he chooses. This way if he is doing something amoral he can always cover his tracks. The Republicans are taking away our rights, and turning this country into a communist country.


Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwnnnnnnnnnnnnn nnnnnnnnn...

[metalheadrr3]

A lot goes on behind the closed doors of the government. They've always had the ability to wiretap and I am sure they've used that ability a million times. At least now they are telling us they are doing it. Plus what kind of phone conversations are you having that you are worried about the government knowing. There are almost 300 million people in this country, they're probably only going to follow a few hundred, and those are mostl likely terror suspect. They aren't tapping grandma making calls to see who's coming over to play bridge. Now I do see the chance for abuse, but in my view if it keeps some of these nuts from causing mass destruction, it's all good.

[Thierry Martin]

A lot goes on behind the closed doors of the government. They've always had the ability to wiretap and I am sure they've used that ability a million times. At least now they are telling us they are doing it. Plus what kind of phone conversations are you having that you are worried about the government knowing. There are almost 300 million people in this country, they're probably only going to follow a few hundred, and those are mostl likely terror suspect. They aren't tapping grandma making calls to see who's coming over to play bridge. Now I do see the chance for abuse, but in my view if it keeps some of these nuts from causing mass destruction, it's all good.

Do you really believe that Bush is incapable of lying? So you trust him to be the final judge of who gets to be put behind bars, and tortured, without recourse to any defense whatsoever. Even to know the charges? And you overthrew Sadam for this?

The ability to wiretap makes a lot of sense in many situations. But what is wrong with the courts having the final say in who and why? Again, the power is moving from the people into the office of a man committed to "democracy and freedom." But he wants powers only given to dictators.

It appears that the same people who brought us Vietnam are bringing us the war in Iraq. Republicans have always lamented the loss of presidential power caused by Nixon's abuses. And now Bush is wiretapping, Nixon Watergate style, multiplied a million times. And he is trying to undo the Vietnam loss, by continuing a war started in error, to avoid the idea that all those killed so far died in vain. There will be terrorists until the end of time, so I don't see how you can win a war on terrorists anyway.

The US is being destroyed from within by one of the stupidest "leaders" in history. I doubt the damage will last less than one hundred years, possibly one thousand. And it may easily lead to the loss of America as the world's only superpower. And the next challenger to America's dominance will only have to be anti-US to gather the support needed to overthrow the US as the leader of the "once-free" world.

[Svenwulf]

really wanted to add something profound or humorous in regards to my agreement with the point of this thread, and was at a loss. and then, in the you cant make this stuff up dept:

By DAVID ESPO and JIM KUHNHENN, Associated Press Writers 27 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - Rep. Mark Foley (news (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/DailyNews/politics/news/ap/ap_on_go_co/congressman_e_mails/20456284/*http://news.search.yahoo.com/search/news?fr=news-storylinks&p=%22Rep.%20Mark%20Foley%22&c=&n=20&yn=c&c=news&cs=nw), bio (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/capadv/bio/ap/ap_on_go_co/congressman_e_mails/20456284/SIG=117gb1ga9/*http://yahoo.capwiz.com/y/bio/?id=178), voting record (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/capadv/vote/ap/ap_on_go_co/congressman_e_mails/20456284/SIG=11g8k5p01/*http://yahoo.capwiz.com/y/bio/keyvotes/?id=178)), R-Fla., abruptly resigned from Congress on Friday in the wake of questions about e-mails he wrote a former teenage male page.

"I am deeply sorry and I apologize for letting down my family and the people of Florida I have had the privilege to represent," he said in a statement issued by his office.
His departure sent Republicans scrambling for a replacement candidate less than six weeks before midterm elections in which Democrats are making a strong bid to gain control of the House.
Foley's two-sentence statement gave no reason for Foley's decision to abandon a flourishing career in Congress. But several officials said the resignation had been prompted by the e-mails, and he took his action as fresh details emerged about electronic messages he had sent.
Foley, 52, had been a shoo-in for a new term until the e-mail correspondence surfaced in recent days.
His resignation further complicates the political landscape for Republicans, who are fighting to retain control of Congress. Democrats need to win a net of 15 Republican seats to regain the power they lost in 1994.

more on this link: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060929/ap_on_go_co/congressman_e_mails

[TonyM]

On the other hand; if they are busy pursuing illegal sexual liasons, that's less time that they have to screw up my finances...er, I mean the country.

A free market economy which I would think all of us that trade would welcome, is best served by neither the GOP or the Dems. Less government control of every little thing we do is what is needed. Every time we give up one seemingly small right it only paves the way for the next until you look back at what has now become a mountain of rights stripped away. When thinking about this I always think back to the scene in Demolition Man where Sly is told salt is not allowed because the government has determined it is bad for you; what happens when the government is allowed to rule it's people instead of serve them.

[MoMoney4Me]

Democrat Fairy Tales
http://cagle.msnbc.com/working/060928/ramirez.jpg

[Thierry Martin]

Democrat Fairy Tales
http://cagle.msnbc.com/working/060928/ramirez.jpg

Republican Fairy Tales

After killing millions of suspected terrorists, and anybody who doesn't think the US is the greatest nation on earth, and removing even free thought, movement and privacy for our safety, we finally rid the world of terrorism. Now we can relax, because no one will harm us, as we, the chosen wonderful people, continue to exercise our unalienable right to consume 80% of the world's resources.

[TonyM]

I love political cartoons, here's a favorite;

http://www.cramersmadmoney.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=382&stc=1&d=1159624253

[TheChartGuru]

Democrat Fairy Tales
http://cagle.msnbc.com/working/060928/ramirez.jpg


I love the cartoon. Thanks for sharing MoMoney. Notice that Granpa has read only half of the book to Junior. The later chapters include how Dems beat the Republicans in 2008 with a 95% landslide, then they were able to bring the cost of gasoline down to .35/gallon, although most people are riding bicycles since the Dems put the Big Three auto makers out of business back in 2012. Big Oil companies got what they deserve, beacuse of their record-breaking profits back in 2005-2010, when the Dems approved a 100% gasoline tax forcing all american oil companies out of business except for Chavez's Citgo gas stations. Unemployment was reduced to 1%, Mexico and the U.S. became one nation. Thanks to stemcell discoveries, 148 year old Ted Kennedy is in his 4th term as President(yes, Dems ammended the Constitution so a President can hold office for a maximum of 20 years). Dems have used the law of Emminent Domain to bulldoze homes to plant more trees so the chipmunks and squirrels can reproduce and not become instinct. Thanks to Hezbohla and Al-queda subsidies, all Americans enjoy free health care. In the year 2024, the Democrats proudly celebrated the one billionth aborted baby and took much of the credit for population control. Al Gore was so successful in his war on global warming, that Florida is now named the Mild State, with its cool 59 degree summer temperature and its sub zero winters. Thanks to Al Gore,the winters in the midwest are harsh though, but most residents there enjoy comfort when they fly to Iran for the winter and enjoy the warmer climate, thanks to their nuclear energy program that gives them unlimited energy supply for ever. Mahmoud Ahmadinejad was right. He only wanted nuclear power for energy, not to build nuclear weapons! How could we have been so wrong? Back in 2006, when that evil President Bush was president and misleading the people on the global war on terror, many people thought that we were near the ends of time. Surely, our Savior Jesus Christ was about to come in Glory at any moment, but luckily the Democrats took office just 2 years later and saved the world, largely in part because of the beloved United Nations, 113 year old(thanks stemcells) President Bill Clinton.
In the last chapter, Granpa reads to Junior how the Democrats were so proud to abolish smoking, gasoline vehicles, killed a billion babys, saved the squirrel, punished drug companies and big oil, closed down all restaurants that used transfatty acids to cook, how they allowed anyone to vote, including illegals and inmates, even dead people, how they allowed same sex marriage or marriage to animals. Democrat grandpa is proud that capitalism is vertually non existant now. The Dems eliminated the upper middle class and now only a lower middle class society exists. Dems were so appauled that our gonvernment used loud music and cold rooms to interrogate the enemy that they abolish all interrogations. We are no longer feared by other nations and everyone loves us now. In fact, the super power nations like Thailand, Iran, North Korea, Peru and Jamaica provide us with most of our infrastucture in exchange for agriculture products that we have in abundance now, since the Emminent Domain law passed in early 2000's. We are so happy to be loved and felt sorry for now.
"Yes Junior, thank goodness(can't say God), that the suckers, I mean the American people, voted Democrat in 2008 to save our freedoms, because we Democrats always know what's good for you". ;)

The Guru has spoken

[Svenwulf]

not to kill everyone's buzz with something irrelevant as facts:

Foley served on the comitee for abducted and exploited children.

as a west coast, godless liberal, this makes me want to string Foley up from a tree! this has nothing to do with partisanship, although the Rs are good at using that as a dodge. as cowardly as the democrats have been since 9/11, my critical thinking tells me this is not as dangerous as the intellectual dishonesty that republicans now embrace. good luck all!

[Svenwulf]

clarification: Foley was chair of the caucus!

[TheChartGuru]

Dishonesty is not a Republican disease. Not that long a go a Democrat president lied to the nation about having sex with an intern and other women.
Humans are not perfect and we will always fall into temptation and other sins. Just yesterday, I heard on the news that two priests were charge with stealing $3 million(?, sorry forgot the exact amount) from the Church for their own personal use including gambling and personal real estate investments. We're all going to be very disappointed when we rely on other human beings for leadership and morality. I am Christian because I am a sinner and need guidance from my Savior. Only Jesus Christ was perfect. I can only reach the promise land through Jesus Christ. Amen!

The Guru has spoken

[Svenwulf]

to compare inappropriate sexual liasons between consenting ADULTS to a pedofile is unacceptable. humans are falible, and perhaps even pedofiles can be rehabilitated (persoanlly not interested in finding out) intellectual dishonesty is a trait all politicians posses, but (hating to sound like a bad bumper sticker) when clinton lied no one died. perhaps if your ilk were so forgiving of the failings of humans, instead of the feeding frenzy of media tripe that was the monica thing, our nation could have focused more clearly on looming threats, such as obl? personally i plan to throw away my vote on comejo for ca gov, since diebold will count it as a vote for arnie anyway.

[TonyM]

Now we're coooking with fire; politics and religion in the same thread, I've been party to a few of these discussions before; entertaining yes, but not much friendliness afterward. I like my religion as I do my politics, less is more therefore aetheism is appealing to me, it's also afaik the least expensive option and nobody declares war in the name of nihilism.

As far as Foley goes; doesn't it seem a little short sighted to think that only Republican politicians are sodomizing page boys on the Hill? This is nothing new, Republicans and Democrats alike knew of this before election smear campaigns were in full swing. Who's worse, the offender or the rest of them for keeping quiet until now when it is in their interest to go public?

[MoMoney4Me]

Hillary Clinton gets elected President and is spending her first night in the White House.

The ghost of George Washington appears, and Hillary says, "How can I best serve my country?"

Washington says, "Never tell a lie,"

Ouch! Says Hillary, I don't know about that.

The next night, the ghost of Thomas Jefferson appears...Hillary says, "How can I best serve my country?"

Jefferson says, "Listen to the people,"

Ho! I really don't want to do that.

On the third night, the ghost of Abe Lincoln appears...Hillary says, "How can I best serve my country?"

Lincoln says, "Go to the theater."

[MoMoney4Me]

Clinton on the Titanic
Reagan, Nixon and Clinton are on the Titanic.
The ship hits the iceberg and sinks slowly.
Everybody starts screaming, panicking, etc.
Reagan shouts: "Women and children first."
Nixon goes: "Screw the women." Clinton replies: "Do you think we have time?"

[BuyOnDips]

http://www.investors.com/editorial/editorialcontent.asp?secid=1501&status=article&id=244423511626964

[Svenwulf]

thank you buyondips for joining the convo with something remotely fact based. i found the column interesting. as someone who enjoys looking at history, i found ibd's recollection somewhat skewed, but such is the perogative of an editorial. i would point out ibd's central theme: how dems are weak on national security, ignores the fact how little influence dems have had in shaping nat sec policy of the examined historical perspective. recounting the 4 years of Carters failures does little to address the 12 years bush/regan spent promoting right wing/ fundementalists (they still call themselves muhajaeen) that primarily constitute our enemy today. and more importantly, i feel assigning blame for history does little for today, save perhaps our ability to learn from it.

[madcowdisease]

Vote Libertarian to get free from government control.

Amen.

lp.org

[TheChartGuru]

http://www.investors.com/editorial/editorialcontent.asp?secid=1501&status=article&id=244423511626964


Looking at that time line, Clinton lied AND hudreds died!

The Guru has spoken

[Svenwulf]

here is something to chew on: cost($) of war in iraq. serious intellectual dishonesty by our "leaders" take a look:

http://nationalpriorities.org/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=182

[TheChartGuru]

here is something to chew on: cost($) of war in iraq. serious intellectual dishonesty by our "leaders" take a look:

http://nationalpriorities.org/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=182


Yup, freedom isn't free

The Guru has spoken

[Will]

maybe it's me,
but I'd rather have my elected officials stick cigars in an intern
than committing homosexual statutory rape.

What's worse is the speaker of the house has known for at least a year.

[Will]

I also had a question about this I was hoping someone could clear up.

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=2519245

Why is Frist for the Taliban? and why would he tell the troops that?

Call the Democrats soft on defense if you want, but this guy is just an idiot!

[BuyOnDips]

Will, who committed homosexual statutory rape? Is Dan Rather still doing the news?

http://www.investors.com/editorial/editorialcontent.asp?secid=1501&status=article&id=244680809798238

[Thierry Martin]

Will, who committed homosexual statutory rape? Is Dan Rather still doing the news?

http://www.investors.com/editorial/editorialcontent.asp?secid=1501&status=article&id=244680809798238

What the article is saying is that it's better to have a pedophile Republican fighting terrorism than a "cut-and-run" Democrat who's probably just as perverted. Then the article says that everyone knew about this, so why is it coming out just before the elections. Well... that's a good question. Is it possible that the Republicans were hoping it would come out AFTER the elections? I'm sure the Democrats were happy waiting to let it leak now! Maybe they were being patriotic and hoping no one would know, so we wouldn't have to lose another Republican anti-terrorist genius.

[TonyM]

Will, who committed homosexual statutory rape? Is Dan Rather still doing the news?

http://www.investors.com/editorial/editorialcontent.asp?secid=1501&status=article&id=244680809798238

Welcome to the Judicial system; guilty until proven financially independent...unless you're blonde and too good looking to go to jail;)

[Will]

Will, who committed homosexual statutory rape? Is Dan Rather still doing the news?

http://www.investors.com/editorial/editorialcontent.asp?secid=1501&status=article&id=244680809798238

I think it's safe to say he wanted to, right?

What makes you believe him when he says he didn't?

I guess he has always been a man of his word.

[Thierry Martin]

Would the speaker of the house, learning that a democratic congressman was having cyber-sex with high school juniors coming to Washington as pages, withhold the information until AFTER the election? Is that really the right time, after the public has been hoodwinked?

[aiki14]

I'm gonna agree with those "lefties" who are pushing for Hastert to resign, you know who they are, those communists liberals like Pat Buchanan and Lawrence Kudlow. Also a nice bit of support for the Republicans from Tom Friedman in todays NY Times, here's a snippett,

"It is so important that the Republicans lose, because if the Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld-Rice team can get away with the grotesque incompetence they have exhibited in Iraq — a war that was not preordained to fail, but was never given a proper chance to succeed — it makes this country look like a banana republic.

If on the morning after the election these people come out smirking that their efforts to scare the public into voting again for their candidates worked, and therefore they can just stay the present course in Iraq — which is not working — it will send a terrible message about our democracy. It will tell us that the country is so divided, and so many districts gerrymandered in favor of Republicans, that performance does not matter any longer. Unless you are caught sending e-mail to a Congressional page soliciting sex, your seat is safe."

I look at this as winning because your opponent has a groin pull, It's nice to win but it's less satisfying than a true victory. But since the rubes aren't gonna get an intelligence transplant akin to "Flowers for Algernon" we'll have to hold our noses and let the bad guys implode.
Disclaimer: Liberal, Atheist and currently listening to people here in Japan ask me how my countrymen can be so foolish.
(watched the Yankee game this morning in Japanese, Jeter is amazing in any language, MVP? I think so)

[Svenwulf]

hope the trip is going well aiki!


talk about counting your chickens before they hatch- or maybe the october surprise is in the bag?

Congress sets aside $20M for wars' ends

By ANNE PLUMMER FLAHERTY, Associated Press Writer Wed Oct 4, 2:03 PM ET

WASHINGTON - The military's top generals have warned Iraq (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=Iraq) is on the cusp of a civil war and that U.S. troops must remain in large numbers until at least next spring. But if the winds suddenly blow a different direction, Congress is ready to celebrate with a $20 million victory party.
Lawmakers included language in this year's defense spending bill, approved last week, allowing them to spend the money. The funds for "commemoration of success" in Iraq and Afghanistan (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=Afghanistan) were originally tucked into last year's defense measure, but went unspent amid an uptick in violence in both countries that forced the Pentagon (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=Pentagon) to extend tours of duty for thousands of troops.
Republicans have yet to claim responsibility for the provision. Democrats say it was likely added by the Senate's majority Republicans, and less than five weeks from congressional elections are pointing to it as another example of where the GOP has gone astray handling the war in Iraq.
"If the Bush administration is planning victory celebrations, Americans deserve to know what their plan is to get us to a victory in Iraq," said Rebecca Kirszner, spokeswoman for Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev.
Carolyn Weyforth, spokeswoman for Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-Tenn., said, "Republicans are confident we will be victorious in the ongoing war in terror, and we look forward to a time when those funds can be used to honor the men and women who have risked and given their lives."
Under the language, the president could "designate a day of celebration" to honor troops serving in the two wars. The president also could call on the nation "to observe that day with appropriate ceremonies and activities" and issue awards to troops who have served honorably.
The Pentagon could spend up to $20 million of its $532 billion budget in 2007 for the commemoration, minus any private contributions it might receive for such an event.
The money will be available for the 2007 budget year, which began Oct. 1.
Some 140,000 U.S. troops remain in Iraq, with a drawdown not expected until at least early next year.
About 20,000 more are in Afghanistan. Last year, Bush administration and Pentagon officials had hoped thousands of troops could be brought home before the Nov. 7 elections.
Proclaiming victory in the Iraq war has already proven to be tricky business.
President Bush (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=President+Bush) was slammed by critics for delivering his "Mission Accomplished" speech in May 2003 aboard an aircraft carrier. While troops had successfully stormed Iraq and toppled Saddam Hussein (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=Saddam+Hussein)'s regime in Baghdad, the fight over control in the nation against a violent insurgency had just begun.
Vice President Dick Cheney (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=Dick+Cheney) also was ridiculed for suggesting last year that the insurgency was in its "final throes."

disclaimer: i am ALL FOR celebrating and honoring our servicepeople's struggle and sacrafice. i am sure the Rs will say im not, when i question why we are budgeting for something, by the Rs own recollection, will be years in the coming.

[jacobxross]

The system of democracy has failed us. THe republicans have won the senate, congress, and of coarse our presidents staff is all republican. Not only that, many judicial members are right winged and alot of media is too. Because of this majority of republicans, it is easier for the administration to establish an agenda, because everyones on their side. So what I'm asking you to do is vote democrat, we need a balance of power.

Jake

[TheChartGuru]

I would gladly vote Democrat, Independent or Green if anyone can explain the plan of any of these parties to win the war on global terror(North Korea just tested an under nuclear bomb), improve the economy, not raise taxes, lower unemployment, not kill babies, stop ILLEGAL immigration, and lower the price of gas under $2. Please don't tell me how much you hate the current administration and why you should not vote Republican. Lets stay focus and please tell me why I SHOULD vote Democrat, Independent or Green. Thank you

The Guru has spoken